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Why the suicide rate in men is a feminist topic

Why the suicide rate in men is a feminist topic

We have been sadly speaking a lot in our house about men dying by suicide lately, one of those numbers in the statistics has become a name, and a face for us.

Coincidently on Tuesday, The Office for National Statistics released its numbers and it found that the suicide rate among men has hit a two-decade high in England and Wales. So, I cannot make the topic about anything else this week, I am talking about this because this is a feminist topic. 

(Here is the video or you can keep reading! or do both!)

 

 

I will always defend that men should be feminists because it is the right thing to do. Even if there was nothing in it for them they should support enthusiastically and unapologetically the movement because half of the population deserves better. That should be enough. But even those who disagree with that assessment should also be feminist, and they should do it for selfish reasons. The patriarchy is killing them!

I am talking about a society that strips men from everything associated with feminine from very very early stages (parents comfortable with their BABY son wearing a pink outfit in public please raise your hands!). The problem is that the association of what belongs to who is arbitrary and absurd in most cases (like the colour pink, for example), and some of the inherently human things that men are forbidden to embrace on the name of manhood can actually improve their lives, and in some cases, save it.

If I ask around who is more emotional, men or women, there will be an overall consensus that it's women. I hope you are all visualising Bridget Jones eating ice-cream in tears. But when asking parents of both boys and girls about specifically their 2 kids the answers are much more diverse, and if something, my feeling is that it gravitates towards the opposite. But of course that changes at some point. Women are indeed perceived as more emotional because they show their emotions more and have fewer limitations to express them, while men carry a social penalty of some sort if they express them, so they bottle them up. Men are tough that toughness is their currency, the same way women's is beauty. 

I love the way Gloria Steinem explains it "There is a full circle of human qualities we all have a right to, and men are confined to the ‘masculine’ ones, which are seventy per cent, and women are confined to the ‘feminine’ ones, which are thirty per cent. Women are missing more, but men are still missing a lot." I will add to this that men, despite their privilege, have a disadvantage in this situation and face extra strong societal barriers of access to those feminine areas. 

Girls and women take some sort of pride being identified as tomboys, being one of the guys... there is a sense of achievement and almost upgrade to be accepted in the men's group as a peer. We talk about the empowerment of women when they are conquering male-dominated areas, when they are demanding their legitimate place in the desk. But what positive words do we have for men when they are making the journey in the other direction? .

Women through history have been wrecking walls that kept them away from a better place (a lot of times legal walls!) a place of money, power, sexuality... I am not saying that those places are always easy, but they are very socially rewarded and valued and they come with choices. These is little reward or incentive for for men  when society has made it very clear who is winning and who is not?

It is relatively easy and instinctive to tell your daughter that she should aim to be whatever and whoever she wants, that she can be the superhero that saves the day too. Are we doing the same with our boys? Are we putting twice the effort to educate them emotionally because once they go in the big bad world they will need to overcompensate the monotonous message about what manhood looks like? Does it feel like we are telling them that they can also be less? That they don't have to be as much? Have we bought into the stupid idea of what is more and what is less?

Even those who refuse women in "masculine" arenas respect, in a way, the "balls" that granted them a place there. They value all the qualities that those women needed to get there (determination, bravery, resilience...) because they consider that those qualities are, indeed masculine. But for those same people, it is considered a shame the man who dreams to be the main caregiver, the man who puts relationships and mental health before success and career, the one who prefers connections above admiration. And how much they are missing out with that lack of choice. 

I love men. Sometimes I think that I love men more than most men! I love them and want more for them and from them. And because I love them I know that their narrative of manhood is not enough, even if it is more privileged than womanhood. But because it is framed in a space of victory, of more, of better, it is more difficult to escape, who would want to downgrade? Who wants to give up power, measured in toughness, if vulnerability is perceived as its biggest enemy, weakness.

We need to do better, we need to explore why men are dying by suicide every day. We need to have the difficult talks and try to figure things out. Men need to be aware of what they are lacking and the importance of it and keep each other accountable to build something better, to redefine what they want the expression"to be a man" to mean for them and the generations to come. 

I am going to challenge you today, now, to write to a man or a group of men about the suicide rate in men. To ask them what they think about it, what they think there is behind it all, how they see things changing. It all starts with a conversation.  

11 Responses

Cadet Amn Lirette

Cadet Amn Lirette

September 22, 2022

Whether feminists want to admit it or not women are a part of the problem with male suicide. Not all but certain women who fall into the category of (financial, relationship, legislative and, exedra) contribute to male suicide at which I plead. We have a lot to fix in this count try before male suicide can begin to die down. However this matter belongs to us men. I don’t care how bad y’all want to get involved, the tops of feminism are probably doing this to promote feminism which sounds bad in our case but it is good in y’all’s case. The sad thing is if this truest was a matter for feminists y’all would have already been involved with the issue. I will state this as I will for a century. This is not a woman’s place to get involved with a man’s problems especially if women are a part of the problem. Like chill out on the divorces and the sues. Stop being disloyal many men have stopped dating because women have hurt them that bad mentally. With all do respect stay out of the male suicide issue. When it becomes recognized as a global problem and we stop getting blamed for many things when women have also done some bad . . . Then, just then can feminists get involved. I say this because y’all might make the problem worse than it already is.

Lorenzo

Lorenzo

September 01, 2022

The responsibility is: Feminism, criminal feminism.

Bradley Homan

Bradley Homan

July 11, 2022

It is not surprising to me to see a feminist proclaim that feminism is good for both men and women. However, by saying the existence of “the patriarchy system” is a major reason society has not yet established more equitable conditions I can’t help but think the reality of the last fifty years of day-to-day experience has somehow been lost, and thus is being overlooked.

When I graduated from college, fifty years ago, and wanted to enter the work force as a programmer, I found politicians had enacted a series of laws which in effect mandated that companies should hire more women (which essentially resulted in those companies not hiring men). The problem was (and which still exists today) the legislation DID NOT MANDATE that the female potential employees had to first be required to acquire the necessary education and/or job skills needed to perform the jobs they were being hired for. As a result, after I finally got hired (upon receiving a Masters Degree in Computer Science), I found that women who had benefited from the employment opportunity mandated by politicians had frequently left the companies they were initially hired at, as they were in over their heads due to their lack of proper education and/or experience.

The ultimate effect was that because government laws and regulations forced companies to hire unqualified women simply to rectify a statistical imbalance in a profession, while at the same time not hiring qualified men, the companies ended up wasting valuable resources while both young women and young men wasted valuable time early in their careers, all to satisfy the political goals espoused by a vocal group who presented ideas which seemed to be good but whose execution was generally not well-thought-out.

Accordingly, I suggest that individuals who profess support for feminism should step outside their feminist ideology and conduct a thorough review of that ideology’s proposals from a holistic point of view encompassing all of the components making up society (women, men, companies, economics, national security, etc.) to determine a more realistic approach to solving the problems they claim exist (instead of simply relying on activism to achieve a patchwork of limited legal “solutions” which have left serious societal damage in their wake).

Duncan

Duncan

June 17, 2022

We are a hypergamous species, meaning that high-status males are sought out disproportionately more by females for reproduction, but as we have a 1:1 female/male birth rate, that leaves a large glut of lower-status males that will not reproduce. This is borne out by reality too: typically, most women reproduce, but only around 60% of men reproduce. In short, we are a species of many mothers and fewer fathers.

Schopenhauer said that women are the gatekeepers to our species, and he meant it literally. Women choose which men will pass on their genetic material to the next generation, and which will be lost to history. If you are a woman, your are competing with other women for the (best) man, but as a man, you are competing with other men for (any) women. Think about how this would affect your reproductive strategy if you were a man, not knowing at what level of the status hierarchy you would be born into.

Evolution has favoured different traits in men and women partially for this reason. The real existential threat most men face skews the cost-benefit analysis of high-risk / high-reward behaviour. A man is more likely to risk it all, and be brave, and show typical “masculine” traits, as he literally has less to lose than a woman, who holds reproductive control. She will (most likely) reproduce at some point, whereas he might reproduce if he plays his cards right, leverages those bigger muscles and reduced emotional sensitivity.

In most cases, masculine and risk-taking traits simply result in an early death of the male. As a previous poster highlighted, the overwhelming majority of workplace deaths are men dying completing dangerous – but higher paying – tasks. Or they fight wars against each other, or undergo dangerous treks seeking of glory and riches. Occasionally though, that high-risk strategy pays off, and the lucky male climbs up the social hierarchy.

He may be a genetic wreck – short, prone to heart-disease and male-pattern balding – but he’s played his cards right, backed the right horse, and now enjoys the fruits of his high-risk labour. Think of those ageing billionaires and their 20-something beautiful wives. A successful businessman or glorious warrior has to my mind achieved more than a young woman who was simply born beautiful – yet our society and our genetics treat them as equals. 



Likewise, it seems unfair that less attractive, but harder-working women are bound to a lower status than a beautiful 20 something woman. How can it be that funny, caring, intelligent and family oriented women are considered lower-status than the genetically gifted airhead? It isn’t fair, just as it isn’t “fair” that close to half of all men will not pass on their genetic material and so many dwell at the bottom of the status hierarchy.

No number of feminist lectures or MGTOW meet-ups will change that reality. The two opposing movements are really reflections of the same fundamental truth – it’s difficult to be low-status for your group – and some relief and movement toward a more equitable society would be nice. There’s no harm in asking, but our species didn’t come this far by being nice. If you’re alive today, it’s because your (male) ancestors outcompeted their peers.

Credit where credit is due: feminism is not wrong in addressing men (at the top of the hierarchy) holding disproportionately more power than women. But it completely fails to recognise the vast majority of lower-status males at the bottom of the status pyramid. Feminism builds a theory of patriarchy based on its observations (looking up the pyramid) but then erroneously applies it to all men equally (including the vast majority of whom dwell at the bottom of the pyramid).


Very few feminists protest the lack of women in refuge collection, nor address the difference in life expectancy or academic achievement between men and women, nor proclaim their solidarity with the men that toil day and night to give their daughters a better life. It is an ideology that claims victimhood, while ignoring the pleas of those less fortunate.

Feminist theory blames the patriarchy and toxic masculinity exclusively, and says nothing of the wider societal forces that weigh heavy on those men at the bottom of the status pyramid. The same forces that push high-status men to the top the pyramid. 



If you are thinking that fighting the patriarchy sounds a lot like rallying against our hypergamous nature, then the issue arises that you simply cannot fight hypergamy. It’s who we are, it’s in us, just as it’s in other species. In any case, it is as much the result of female behaviour than male behaviour (more if you ask Schopenhauer). This would be a difficult pill for any feminist to swallow. 



A heads-up, for the suicidal man, your post might read very harshly. In blaming the patriarchy, you are putting the responsibility for someones suicidal thoughts at their own feet. They are men, they belong to the “patriarchy”, and it is the patriarchy that is killing them. If you love men as much as you claim to, I would kindly ask you to question your own belief system a little more.

If you are a suicidal man (or woman) reading this: don’t give up just yet. If you have been put on this Earth, and have spent most of that time depressed and anxious, accept that you have been served a very cruel hand. Existentially, this should make you angry. Use that anger.

james morris

james morris

May 03, 2022

The real reason men are killing themselves is economics. The greatest shift in wealth, from one group to another, has occurred during the last few decades; from males to females. Keep playing the hocus pocus about “boys don’t cry” but it is about money and the shrivelled life for men who don’t have enough because being a poor man is like being a very ugly woman.

Tristan Price

Tristan Price

April 15, 2022

Thanks so much for this. I have been trying to find the words to explain this, but you have done it brilliantly here. I get so annoyed when I see feminism presented as a zero sum game – women’s path to liberation is portrayed as somehow coming at the expense of men. But as you write so well, feminism can and must help to tackle male suicide. Tackling hyper masculinity helps everyone.

Jason Bargy

Jason Bargy

April 15, 2022

I am a man and women hate men both good and bad. Women think they can push around a man. Wait till there is no man around to push around. I am sick of these feminist women.

Mark Manning

Mark Manning

March 25, 2022

Men don’t matter.

They are 4 to 5 times more likely than women to be murdered in a public place yet the move is to make the streets safer for women. This is because men don’t matter.

Men die by suicide at a rate 3 times higher than that of women. A newspaper headline a few months ago highlighted an increase in female suicides. The fact that this increase resulted in male/female suicides of 3/1 instead of the previous 4/1 wasn’t mentioned. This is because men don’t matter.

If 90% of workplace deaths were of women the screaming about it would never end. In fact 90% of workplace deaths are of men. There is no screaming about this because men don’t matter.

BBC Radio 4’s Woman’s Hour recently ran articles on the continuing dominance of men in traditionally male dominated industries (bus driving and lorry driving). The articles were along the lines of ‘shock, horror, even today in the 21st century, about 90% of bus and lorry drivers are men’. I advised the programme that, shock, horror, even today, 90% of nurses, 95% of midwives and about 100% of junior school teachers are women. I received no reply and my figures were not mentioned on the programme. This is because men don’t matter.

When the majority of English solicitors (my own profession) were men this was considered a gender imbalance in need of addressing. In recent years the balance has flipped and there is now a small female majority. In addition, of all newly qualifying solicitors in recent years, around 63% were women. This, apparently, is not a gender imbalance in need of addressing because….men don’t matter.

I could go on and on with other examples of society’s view that men don’t matter. Unfortunately most men can’t see the problem and women couldn’t care less about it.

If in doubt, always remember that….men don’t matter.

Obi

Obi

March 25, 2022

What the hell I just read. You ought to be ashamed of yourself. The most ridiculous thing I’ve ever had the displeasure of reading

Alex Smith

Alex Smith

May 04, 2021

In your opinion, what are the ideal government roles and laws in a feminist utopia?

Mcrow

Mcrow

April 21, 2021

Men are dying every day because of how feminism treats men. That’s why there are groups like mgtow. Feminist laws and family courts, and false sexual claims against men are on the rise. As a mgtow men are not 2nd class citizens. Feminists treat real men as wage slaves to be if it women. The gender wage gap is a lie..,, and the majority of men commit suicide because there is no help for men. Women have more rights than men. Women use men for assets and goods.. Real women want real men who are masculine,.. why do women for the bad boy in a relationship? Some thing to think about. Also because of female superiority and what can happen to men just because a woman is angry at a man. With marriage rates dropping and birth rates dropping as well. It’s not worth getting into a relationship, marriage, or having children is not worth ruining your life over women. Life is good for men that are not anchored down. Women should be scared about mgtow.

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